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Author Topic: Quest Rewards?  (Read 18694 times)

Christian Knudsen

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2008, 09:43:38 PM »
I'd like to wait with the medals until I've implemented the drawing of ascii images, otherwise medals would use one method, while "cut-scenes/images" would use another.

KnowArcana

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2009, 05:09:00 PM »
I am pretty disappointed in the 'no rewards' feature of quests.  I am also pretty disappointed that I cannot make randomized events.  Here is my quest, as futile as it will eventually be.


Before you read, copy, whatever ..  The idea was to make a fun game of killing the random people by creating a Department-7 Agency (Open Game Content, thanks Wizards of the Coast).  As a member of the Department-7 Agency you would receive quests to hunt down pirates that are hiding on remote planets.  

Killing people in the game was so much fun, but I just felt horrified that I was killing innocents.  Gimme some FBI / CIA action please. (Creds would be good.)

Code: [Select]

Title : Department-7

Author : Knowledge Arcana

Achievement : None so far.
// The title and author name will be shown on the quest loading menu in the game

// The achievement will be added to the Achievements section of the player's

// Quine5000 when the quest is completed.

VariableOne : 0

SCENE FirstContact
   ONLOAD
     Variable : VariableOne : 0
     MarkNavPoint : Loye : 2
   /ONLOAD

   MISSION Dept-7
      Description : You have been selected to participate in a Department-7 training course.  You must find Agent H at the Loye Naval Base if you wish to particpate in this training event.
      Objective : Go to Loye Naval Base
      Objective : Speak with Agent H in the Hotel Lobby.
   /MISSION

   CHARACTER

      Color : 11

      FirstName : Agent

      HomeName : Loye Naval Base

      HomeType : Base

      LastName : H

      X : 33

      Y : 18

      Movement : None

   /CHARACTER



   CHARACTERDIALOGUE Agent H

      Character : Good work! You have completed the first mission successfully and found me.  

      Character : Department-7 is looking for new recruits. Pirates have taken to city streets in order to hide.

      Character : We would like to recruit you to take down some of these rogues. You will be . . .
      Character : A Department-7 Bounty Hunter.

      Character : Currently we know 'Villain' has returned to Basin. As a recruit you should take out this simple pirate.

      IF Accept

      // This asks the player 'Accept' or 'Reject'.

         Player : Sure. No problem.

         Character : Good. Here is a standard issue M-42 and some ammo.
  Variable : VariableOne : 1
         ChangeScene : FindVillain1

      ELSE

      // If the player chooses 'Reject', the dialogue will continue here.

         Player : Let me think it over.

         Character : All right. But I don't have all day...

         ChangeScene : WaitingToAcceptFindVillain1

      /ELSE
   /CHARACTERDIALOGUE
      TRIGGER
         Event : Variable : VariableOne : 1
  Result : CreateItem : 1 : M-42 Machine Pistol (0)
         Result : GiveItem : M-42 Machine Pistol : Player
    Result : CreateItem : 2 : M-42 Clip (0)
   Result : GiveItem : M-42 Clip : Player
      /TRIGGER
/SCENE

   SCENE WaitingToAcceptFindVillain1

      CHARACTER

         Color : 11

         FirstName : Agent

         HomeName : Loye Naval Base

         HomeType : Base

         LastName : H

         X : 33

         Y : 18

         Movement : None

      /CHARACTER



      CHARACTERDIALOGUE Agent H

         Character : Made up your mind yet?

         Player : Tell me about the mission again.

         Character : You get to run and gun for Department-7.

         Character : We will contact you buy your Quine about new targets, and you base jump to take them out.

         Character : So, do you accept the mission or not?

         IF ACCEPT

            Player : Of course I do.

            Character : Good. Here is a standard issue M-42 and some ammo.
       Variable : VariableOne : 1
            ChangeScene : FindVillain1

         ELSE

            Player : Let me think it over a bit more.

            Character : Alright, but you are not making the world safer by waiting.

         /ELSE

      /CHARACTERDIALOGUE
         TRIGGER
            Event : Variable : VariableOne : 1
          Result : CreateItem : 1 : M-42 Machine Pistol (0)
            Result : GiveItem : M-42 Machine Pistol : Player
          Result : CreateItem : 2 : M-42 Clip (12)
        Result : GiveItem : M-42 Clip : Player
         /TRIGGER

   /SCENE

  SCENE FindVillain1

      ONLOAD

         MarkNavPoint : Loye : 7
         RemoveNavPointMark : Loye : 2

      /ONLOAD

   CHARACTER

      Color : 6

      FirstName : Villain
      HomeName : Basin

      HomeType : Base
      EquipmentLeftHand : Knife
      Order : Attack
      OrderTarget : Player
      Movement : Local
      X : 78
      Y : 74
      Speed : 50

      Precision : 20

      Strength : 50

   /CHARACTER

   TRIGGER

      Event : CharacterKilledByPlayer : Villain

      Result : QuestDone

   /TRIGGER
/SCENE
[/code]

Christian Knudsen

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #17 on: April 22, 2009, 02:04:24 PM »
Credit rewards has already been discussed a lot and won't be added. What exactly do you mean by "randomized events"?

KnowArcana

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #18 on: April 22, 2009, 06:51:14 PM »
Well, maybe you could add it to the game then.

What I was hoping I could accomplish was creating a different aspect of the game.  Just as you got people hanging out in the bars with quests to offer you could add a person(s) to the bar who would want you to kill a pirate.

Also, I see a flaw in your no rewards system.  What if I equip my guy with a bunch of expensive EQ?  He attacks, I shoot him in the throat, yeah - armor is mine.  I can cash it in.  I can even make the guys abilities sub par.  It might take some extra work but I can get a little more cash this way.

There has got to be an idea that will help you remove the block.  Perhaps a CR aspect, where the software calculates the difficulty of the fight and grants a calculated reward. Maybe just a variable Treasure, that the software randomizes.  I understand why you are holding out, but it is really holding the quest development back, IMO.

Christian Knudsen

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #19 on: April 22, 2009, 09:26:45 PM »
The game currently offers fixer missions to kill "good" targets (mayors, admirals, and the sort). I suppose I could also add fixer missions to kill pirates and "bad guys". Shouldn't be too hard.

Killing a guy and taking his equipment to sell takes more effort than writing a simple script that gives you 10 million credits and ruins the game. Like I've said before, there are plenty of missions that earn you credits in the game - I had hoped for quests to add stories.

Lyndon

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #20 on: April 22, 2009, 11:18:24 PM »
You don't buy a book because you get money at the end of it, or a game for the same reason do you?
You buy them for the narrative :D
Hi there.

KnowArcana

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2009, 07:59:00 PM »
Quote from: "Lyndon"
You don't buy a book because you get money at the end of it, or a game for the same reason do you?
You buy them for the narrative :D


This is in poor taste.  Would you read a college book if it was just narrative?  Probably not.  The book has a reward, knowledge.

Chrisitian, I totally sympathize for your decision.  Allowing game breaking quests into the game will ruin it .. but could you reconsider some of it.  I would again like to recommend a variable called Treasure.  If it was a ship the software would randomly and hidden generate a value of cargo that was on the ship.  If it was a character the software would generate a number of credits.

Story is good, but games are played because they are rewarding.

Cort

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2009, 08:17:56 PM »
Quote from: "KnowArcana"
Chrisitian, I totally sympathize for your decision.  Allowing game breaking quests into the game will ruin it .. but could you reconsider some of it.  I would again like to recommend a variable called Treasure.  If it was a ship the software would randomly and hidden generate a value of cargo that was on the ship.  If it was a character the software would generate a number of credits.

What if the best quests would be 'blessed' by Christian and added to the download page with a reward that he sets (money, trade goods, special items).
The reward setting option would not be available to normal quest developers. Only Christian can set it and it would be based on the difficulty or extensiveness of the quest.

Of course someone could still hack that by reverse engineering, but as has been said elsewhere, that's probably also possible with the savegame files.

An alternative would be to make quests unlock parts of the game (systems or whole areas, certain trading goods, etc.), but I guess that should be reserved to the main storyline quest.


Now that I've written that, I'm not entirely sure that hasn't been suggested before, but I can't be bothered to check right now, sorry.


-- Cort

PS: Remember that we still have the 'medals' feature coming up, if I understood Christian correctly. So that's at least one kind of reward.

Christian Knudsen

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2009, 09:38:31 PM »
Quote from: "Cort"
The reward setting option would not be available to normal quest developers. Only Christian can set it and it would be based on the difficulty or extensiveness of the quest.


That's really interesting! How about this: I'll add a AddCredits function to the scripting syntax, but when you compile it, the compiler will strip this function. However, when you submit your quest script for adding to the 'quests' page, I'll compile it with my own compiler that doesn't remove AddCredit calls. That way I'll be able to check that it isn't a script designed to "cheat" your way to 10 million credits. You'll still be able to compile and test your script like you can now, you just wont get the credit rewards until you submit the script - which will also hopefully motivate players to actually submit their scripts.

Lyndon

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #24 on: April 24, 2009, 10:03:16 PM »
That and you will be able to edit the amount accordingly :D
Hi there.

X Leviathan X

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #25 on: May 01, 2009, 01:17:30 AM »
I like that idea, but what's the point of being so paranoid about all this cheating if there are so many ways around anyway?  If they cheat, let them.  They're spoiling it for themselves, you're only stopping some features from being implemented over this.  Any 7 year old can hex edit a save file, or use a memory editor to change a value, a single player game is just way too easy to hack.

Flyboy

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #26 on: May 01, 2009, 08:10:30 AM »
How does one use a memory editor on a single player game? With multiplayer games it's easy, because you can just use a network package editor. Maybe the worry over cheating is due to the fact that later in the game, when it reaches the point of "conquer and destroy" if someone cheats then they are sure to brag about it and make all of us non-cheaters feel down. Plus it just doesn't seem very fair if someone can nab millions of credits in one go while the rest of us take weeks to earn the money.

X Leviathan X

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #27 on: May 02, 2009, 01:50:59 AM »
You can't just believe everything you read, you know.  And actually, multi player games are harder to hack because they're server sided, so you can't just simply use a packet editor or edit the memories.  Everything is stored on the server, there aren't any save files whatsoever to hex edit so hex editing is out of the question.

My point is, that Christian isn't implementing fun features into Ascii Sector because of over what Christian calls "cheaters".  Like I said, nobody forced anybody to not play legitly, so it's their problem if they spoil the game for themselves only because they chose to not play legitly and took the other option.

Lyndon

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2009, 11:22:14 PM »
On the subject of cheaters and memory editing I found it very easy to find the specific address where money was stored for ascii sector.
I agree with Clear Vision:
Quote from: "Clear Vision"
They're spoiling it for themselves
Hi there.

KnowledgeArcana

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Re: Quest Rewards?
« Reply #29 on: May 05, 2009, 08:05:38 AM »
Quote from: "Christian Knudsen"
Quote from: "Cort"
The reward setting option would not be available to normal quest developers. Only Christian can set it and it would be based on the difficulty or extensiveness of the quest.


That's really interesting! How about this: I'll add a AddCredits function to the scripting syntax, but when you compile it, the compiler will strip this function. However, when you submit your quest script for adding to the 'quests' page, I'll compile it with my own compiler that doesn't remove AddCredit calls. That way I'll be able to check that it isn't a script designed to "cheat" your way to 10 million credits. You'll still be able to compile and test your script like you can now, you just wont get the credit rewards until you submit the script - which will also hopefully motivate players to actually submit their scripts.


I think is a better idea than not allowing us to AddCredits at all.  I like that you are thinking about implementing the killing pirates feature; it would be nice if you would.